Good Leftist Mormons?
A couple weeks ago I posted this quote from Ted Wilson, former mayor of Salt Lake City, active member of the lds church, and proud leftist.
I heaped scorn on Wilson for his comments…but apparantly there are people in Utah who seriously believe the church’s teachings can be used to promote left leaning political philosphy. One group, Mormons for Equality and Social Justice (MESJ), was described this weekend in the Deseret News. I checked out their site and it is very interesting. They really seem to be intellectually honest and though I disagree with some of their conclusions (any time anyone supports government forced re-distribution of income) I find others to be quite compelling (we have an individual responsibility as prosperous member of the church to work for economic equality and the elimination of poverty).
This part of the short pledge members of MESJ struck me as a good attempt to avoid being associated with those who want to harm the chuch:
I understand that MESJ is not a forum for criticizing the doctrines or policies of the LDS Church and that MESJ does not adopt positions on social or political issues which contradict official positions of the Church.
Good for them. I hope they have success in bringing some diversity into the staid political atmosphere that exists in Utah.
6 Comments
RSS feed for comments on this post.
Sorry, the comment form is closed at this time.
The trouble I have with a group like Mormons for Social Justice is that they want to force people to be “Social Justice.” I abhore this kind of thinking. It is important for us to help the poor and the afflicted, but that does not mean that the government should do it. Personally I believe the chruch does a much better job of caring for the poor and afflicted than the government, and I doubt anyone could challange that argument.
Mosiah 11 complains of taxes of a mere 20 percent. Is it “socially just” to charge more for the government than for the Lord? I don’t think so.
Is it “socially just” to deny people the freedom to contract for their own wage? MESJ does because they think that people working for the minimum wage are too dumb to get a higher wage, and therefore the government should force employers.
Is it “socially just” to force American to subsidize the lifestyle of welfare queens and kings? What about “Deseret” (meaning industry)?
Is it “socially just” to steal from the rich to give to the poor (ie progressive taxation)? I don’t think so.
It is “socially just” for for your view of “good environmental stewardship” on other people? I don’t think so.
In the end, the problem I have with MESJ is that their social justice only is possible through the coersive powers of government. Government is not he answer–individuals are the answer. True social justice makes us all free. MESJ’s “social justice” destroyes freedom and justice for all.
Comment by Daniel — June 30, 2003 @ 1:58 pm
I agree with each of Dan’s points but I still have to come out to defend MESJ even though it isn’t a group I’d ever join. Check out my next post.
Comment by Jeremy — June 30, 2003 @ 3:02 pm
That image states it all. How retarded!
Comment by Michael — July 1, 2003 @ 2:05 pm
I don’t know who any of you guys are. I stumbled on this site while looking for info about MESJ because a friend had told me about them. But Jeremy, and Daniel, and Michael, your ranting sounds like you’ve listened to too much Rush and Hannity. All you do is regurgitate the philosophy of knee-jerk conservatives who have you right where they want you. There’s is the politics of greed, pure and simple. It has nothing to do with social justice, and they will use any excuse to make it sell. Did you know that the average CEO salary has increased almost 2000% in the last 20 years? It is not welfare kings and queens they are screwing, it is hard-working people like you and I who earn 30-60K a year and think we have it great. But if OUR salaries had gone up as much as their’s in just the past 5 years, we’d be making as much as $185,000 a year. No, of course you didn’t know that. Rush and Hannity don’t talk about that. But that’s where the discussion on equality and justice needs to start, not with Republican slogans repeated by mindless drones like yourselves.
What did these wealthy CEOs do when they got the power back from the Democrats? Compensate their work force in gratitude for making them rich? No, they cut their own taxes and threw the economy into the most massive deficit in history because “conservative” to them only means CUT TAXES, not be fiscally prudent.
If this philosophy is so great, and so out of harmony with gospel principles, picture yourself making the same arguments you just listed above when you are face to face with the Savior. “But Lord, I didn’t know it was you who was sick or poor. I thought I did it unto welfare queens and kings.”
And, Daniel, let’s start with you EDITING yourself. It’s embarrassing to read the word “chruch” when you’re trying to say “church” because it looks too much like “crutch,” and I know that’s not what you mean. Is it?
Comment by Bill — July 3, 2003 @ 6:53 pm
Daniel, when someone refers to Mosiah and draws from it a lesson that high taxes are bad, I can’t say that he’s wrong. But what an interesting point to focus on. It’s a totally selfish one…I doubt you’re concerned with anybody’s taxes but your own. The lesson that sticks out for me in Mosiah, one that gives me shivers whenever I read it, is when King Benjamin nails us all for our attitudes about the poor: “Perhaps thou shalt say: The man has brought upon himself this misery; therefore I will stay my hand….O Man, whosoever doeth this the same hath great cause to repent.” There’s always a reason we use not to be as charitable as we ought. What does it say about the underpinnings of YOUR personal philosophy that, when the subject is social justice, all you can think of–heck, you even cite scripture–is your own tax burden. “Is it socially just to steal from the rich to give to the poor?” That isn’t the question. Is it SCRIPTURALLY just to ignore the poor? Mosiah 4:16-19 “…and you will not suffer that the beggar putteth up his petition to you in vain.” (Hey, don’t blame me…you’re the one who brought up Mosiah.)
Comment by Bill — July 8, 2003 @ 2:40 am
I think your going the wrong way Daniel– cutting taxes and social programs is not the answer! Why do you ultra conservatives feel it all so necessary to make the government to be evil? you sound as typical rich white males scared of loosing your fat cat way of life. I think that defies the purpose of mormonism. Thats sick. I think you’ve obviously been stuck in Utah too long. I also think your too defensive and not willing enough think about different ideas.. your conservative thinking is leaving you at square 1 man.
Comment by kevin — July 18, 2003 @ 1:22 am