My problem with Democrats is not that some of them are anti-god, but that they are socialists (too many Republicans are socialists too).

This reminds me about your post on Kos and libertarianism. http://www.themannings.org/soapbox/2006/06/08/daily-kosa-libertarian-democrat/
I’m a big fan of Jesse Walker’s brand of left libertarianism–http://www.reason.com/hitandrun/2006/06/how_to_be_a_hal.shtml#014236 I just wish more Democrats would be more libertarian-like (along the lines that Jesse Walker outlines), but they aren’t.

A one party state in Utah is a bad thing and since Democrats in Utah are currently in a very weak position they are ripe for a takeover by Utahns who have good intentions but don\’t want to buy into all the garbage the national Democrats so often represent. Utahns have a chance to mold this small party into a responsive powerful entity if they\’ll quit mindlessly voting for Republicans because people like you are telling them the Democrats are Godless. The party is what its members are and if more Utahns get involved in politics and re-make the Democratic party it could be a great counter to the ignorant BS Republicans keep cramming down our throats.

Cody brought up Rocky Anderson. I think for people outside of Salt Lake, his antics aren’t seen as convincing more people that they should vote Democratic.

You know I agree with you on corporate welfare, though I’m not sure that Democrats are much better than Republicans on the issue. I think they are both terrible.

But the godlessness of the national Democrats will still hurt them. How much does Harry Reid talk about God or his beliefs? Many people aren’t happy about the evangelical/Republican alliance, but how many people in Utah have a problem with what the Republicans have actually done? Maybe the evangelicals are going to show their nuttiness with Romney, we’ll have to see. But many people are ticked off about the shenanigans the ACLU pulls and they associate that with the Democrats.

Lastly, as for Pete Ashdown, on the most important votes, who will cast votes more in line with your beliefs? Pete beats Orrin on DMCA and maybe some copyright stuff, but Pete votes for Reid for Majority Leader and he will likely vote against good Supreme Court and Circuit Court judges. Also Pete Ashdown wants government run health care. As much as I care about the DMCA and issues like that, socialized medicine would be terrible (again, this is why Democrats do not have any credibility on the “industry” issue).

I can’t get over the dems raising such a huge fuss over 2 willing soldier deaths a day during a war they initially helped vote for, and turn away from 2,500 US abortions a day. Even if most of those abortions are legitimate.

Also, when voting in Utah, I have to take into account, ‘Is this person going to do their job? Or promote their party at the cost of their position?’ I think mayor Rocky Anderson is a perfect example of somebody who has almost completely lost track of what a mayor’s job is in his battle to promote the minority parties in Utah.

I’ll vote for any person who I think will best present his place, and have voted for local dems in the past, but I believe Rocky Anderson is an example of why Utahns look through squinted eyes at many minority candidates. Too bad a few have to go off track and ruin things for other minority candidates who could do a great job for their community.

I’ll grant you item 1. I’ll even add to it the problem that politically unpopular (in Utah) homosexual activist groups are perceived to be more closely associated with the Democratic Party than they are the Republican Party. This further contributes to the perception that Republicans are more “moral” than Democrats.

I’ll also grant you a point you didn’t include but that I’m sure you are well aware of. Democrats are terrible on energy policy both locally in Utah and nationally. This area of our platform needs to be repaired if Democrats are going to have success. Until viable new sources of energy are readily available Democratic stonewalling on any and all harvesting of carbon fuels is going to become less and less popular as energy prices continue to increase. Hoping and praying for alternate energy forms while bitching about all new oil production isn’t an energy policy…it is suicide.

I have to break with you on the others.

2. Industry. Government welfare was greatly reduced as a political issue when President Clinton signed the Welfare Reform bill presented to him by the Republican Congress. Even so…Democrats do argue for a social safety net for the poorest in our society and I think that is a great selling point in Utah if done correctly. Utah Democrats recently effectively contrasted their concerns about the slashed benefits of the elderly and the disabled this past legislative session with the irresponsible Republican funding of a new parking structure on Capital Hill. Those who truly need help should be provided for. Government isn’t the best avenue for this but sometimes it is necessary as a last resort. Expenditures for this type of social safety net are not that high and most Utahns support them.

Now if you want to talk about welfare that is truly a problem lets talk about the corporate welfare being doled out to industries and corporations by Republicans on a scale never before seen in our country. Talk about working against “industry as Utah’s motto”! This kind of largesse is harmful to the free market and has degraded competition in many industries to the point where success for many corporations is determined more by lobbying prowess than the ability to cheaply produce what people want to buy. Democrats are by no means pure as the driven snow when it comes to this subject but they aren’t even in the same league as Republicans.

Hmmm…looks like I covered topic 3 in this response as well (a brief mention of the fact that government spends more on non-defense related projects under Bush and Republican majorities in both houses of Congress than it ever has in history also pretty much deals with that topic). I’ll move straight to the last.

4. I think the “anti-God” issue is an area where Democrats have a huge opportunity. The Republican Party has sold its soul to the religious right. They have done so to the point that many politically active people who are only moderately religious or who don’t happen to be Evangelical Christians are turned of by a lot of their rhetoric. I’m looking forward to next year’s Republican presidential primary. I think Romney is going to be savaged because he’s a Mormon. It will be a lot of cheap shot stuff like was done to McCain in South Carolina and it will leave a bad taste in many Utahn’s mouths. Utah Democrats could simply point out that the most powerful Democrat in the Senate is LDS. Clearly Democrats aren’t nearly as bigoted as the Republicans. If Utah’s Democrats can show themselves to be mostly god-fearing and faithful citizens who are against legislating their morality to force others to be “righteous” the time for a political re-alignment to a real two party system in Utah could be at hand.

You’re right that Utah’s Democrats get tagged with the Howard Dean/MoveOn.Org idiocy. They should do more to separate themselves from much of what the national party says and does. Utah may never recover from the one party mess it has become…but I sure hope it does…and I think more Mormons and non-Mormons in Utah are becoming concerned about the problem as time goes by.

1. Abortion. Too many people in the national Democratic Party’s leadership seem to promote abortion with few limits. NARAL and NOW are not Republican supporters.

2. Industry. Not industry as in business, but industry as in Utah’s motto (ie. Deseret). For better or worse, the Democratic Party is seen as the party of handouts and welfare. Mormons know there is a better system than government welfare. The church welfare system works because it relies on personal responsibility and work. Government welfare has failed for 40 years because it does not. Government welfare and welfare schemes are one of the main tenets of the national Democratic Party.

3. Fiscal responsibility. Does anyone really believe that the Democratic Party is any more fiscally responsible than the Republican Party? Both the Democrats and Republicans talk a good game when they are the minority party. The problem with the Democrats is that their beliefs core beliefs encourage spending while Republicans core beliefs are against spending. Political realities change that, but at the Democrats core beliefs encourage governmental spending. Also, is Utah not balancing its budget right now?

4. Godlessness. Too many of the core Democratic groups, such as the ACLU, are not only godless, but anti-God. Which party do religious people support? The party that wants to get rid of all mention of God in public places or the party that at least mentions religion?

Until Utah Democrats and disassociate themselves with these issues, Utahns will continue to vote for Republicans. This Republican Congress and President has been bad news in many ways, but the Republicans haven’t offended the moral sensibilties of Utahns like Howard Dean and the national Democrats do.