How Should We Deal With The Police?
Yesterday I linked to the story about the Utah County woman thrown in jail when confronted by an officer about not watering her lawn. The whole situation spiraled out of control when the woman refused to give the officer her name and he went off on a power trip. In the comments section of that post Dignin asked the question: “…is there a law that says you must identify yourself to an officer, or get arrested?”
You’d think it would be ok to remain silent but the Supreme Court, in Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada, upheld a state law that required citizens to identify themselves to the authoritites when they have reason to believe a law has been broken.
A great website that everyone should spend some time looking at is FlexYourRights.org. Take the quiz they have on their site to see how knowledgible you are your about your civil rights. Too many people think they only need their constitutional rights if they get caught breaking the law. The truth is that when we exercise those rights even when we are innocent of any legal wrongdoing we are keeping ourselves and our society more secure from overbearing cops and malicious growth of government police powers in general. Check out their site and learn how to correctly deal with situations when The Man gets you down.
Here’s a link to the great video produced by Flex Your Rights. Everyone should show this to their kids.
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Too many people think they only need their constitutional rights if they get caught breaking the law.
What are these “constitutional rights” you refer to? Oh, you mean pre-9/11, don’t you? Remember, things are different now. You’re either with us or with the terrorists, and they hate us for our liberty and freedoms. We’ll decide which “constitutional rights” are still necessary in our Glorious War On Terror. Just ask Scooter Libby.
Comment by Part of the Plan — July 9, 2007 @ 10:23 am
You may be correct. Maybe they shouldn’t be called “rights”. How about “currently acceptable plebeian allowances”.
Comment by Jeremy Manning — July 9, 2007 @ 10:40 am
Don’t forget also, it was Glorious Leader who announced that “the Constitution is just a piece of paper.”
Seriously, don’t you believe that eventually this government-sanctioned disdain for traditional constitutional rights and liberties will eventually trickle down to even the Provo Police Department? Actually that’s probably a bad example…they might have a hotline direct to the West Wing.
Comment by Part of the Plan — July 9, 2007 @ 12:21 pm
Oops…my bad. Orem, not Provo. There really is a difference.
Speaking of which, courtesy of KSL.com, here is today’s BGO:
“Orem police spokesman Lt. Doug Edwards said, “Every officer in his career has situations they find themselves getting into, at the end of it they scratch their head and say, ‘gosh, how did this happen?’ Today, I think, was one of those days. Clearly there were some other options available.”"
Comment by Part of the Plan — July 9, 2007 @ 1:37 pm
I spend my Sunday AM’s at a Latino Branch of the LDS Church and work with YM and then with the Boy Scouts on Thursday evenings. They had a discussion yesterday about the police and asked me if I liked them in a general way. Based upon my experiences as an employer of Latinos and African Americans with the racial profiling that occurs, I said ‘no’. Their response was, “That is so brown Brother ___”
Comment by WP — July 9, 2007 @ 7:54 pm
Jeremy, your right that is a very cool website. After I looked at it I thought, why does Jeremy need to know about this? And then after a minute, it hit me! Red Dawn - Bottle Rockets - Trojan Boulevard… you want to be current on your rights so that you will never have to be in that situation again, am I right?!?!
Comment by Dignin — July 13, 2007 @ 9:22 am
Dignin,
Ugh…sounds like I’m busted…again. That was so much fun!
I just think it is important for everyone to exercise their rights when the time comes. I’ve never had to worry about being busted for drugs or anything like that but I’d still tell a cop no if he wanted to search my vehicle or home. I’d do it just cause I have the right to!
Comment by Jeremy Manning — July 13, 2007 @ 9:46 am
A friend of mine is a district court judge in Utah. I asked him if he had seen, in his days on the bench, anything that came under the category of ‘DWB’, driving while brown. He answered to the affirmative, “Happens too often”, he said.
Be glad you are not brown Jeremy. You would be pulled over without cause to provide proof of insurance, registration, driver’s license, etc.
Comment by WP — July 13, 2007 @ 8:51 pm
Too often the 4th Amendment is trampled upon. In my line of work I have seen way too many cases where charges are based on evidence that is seized in contravention to the defendant’s rights. As I have worked to demonstrate the illegality of the evidence discovery I am too often reproached with a comment along the lines of “Well, the guy was guilty wasn’t he?”
The point is that without drawing the line somewhere (maybe the language of the Constitution could provide us with some guidance?) we will find ourselves being subject to a police state where the police is the power. What is truly sad is that there are doubtlessly hundreds of stops and police encounters where the rights of the individual stopped are violated but no evidence of illegality is found. Because no charges stem from the illegal stop, the issue is not pursued - after all, if you are illegally detained by a police officer, but he doesn’t take you into custody, are you going to press charges?
My point is that the illegal stops happen more frequently than the many applications of the exclusionary rule let on. What’s more is that the exclusionary rule at its best does little to deter illegal police conduct.
Although it may sound to the contrary, I’m not succumbing to paranoia. Most police officers are truly motivated by a desire to protect the public. However, there are a few who find the badge to be their carte blanche (and occasionally all have such impulses). Behavoir that follows such impluses and attitudes is truly that which endangers us the most.
Comment by trueredutahn — July 21, 2007 @ 2:46 am
TrueRed,
Thanks for your comment. I completely agree with you and am concerned that so often our government is willing to throw the correct process out the window because the ends seem to justify doing so.
It is nice to hear that there are some in your line of business out there defending all of us by defending the process.
Comment by Jeremy Manning — July 22, 2007 @ 9:11 am
Police brutality today, tomorrow… for some time.
I actually liked the “outrageous” fines for speeding in Virginia. I think some penalties should raised up a couple notches for a while. It might deter crime, but what do i know? I work for the military.
Comment by Michael — August 5, 2007 @ 8:35 pm